Josh Gray: Recruiting is About Changing Lives

Intro:
Today our guest is Josh Gray, Sr. Recruiter with the Allred Group, a leader in elevator industry recruiting. Josh spent 24 years serving his country in the US Airforce, with 15 of those years working as an Airforce Recruiter
Although the transition from military to civilian life can be a challenge for many people, Josh has been successful and has many insights to share on that process. Josh is loving his work recruiting elevator professionals and has found some of the same camaraderie he enjoyed in the military

Summary:
Josh Gray, a senior recruiter at the Allred Group, discussed his transition from a 24-year military career to the elevator industry. Inspired by movies like “Top Gun” and a high school air show, Gray joined the Air Force, eventually becoming a recruiter. He highlighted the challenges of transitioning to civilian life, including adapting to different professional norms and job application processes. Gray emphasized the importance of mentorship and the value of helping people, which he found in both military and civilian roles. He praised the elevator industry for its camaraderie and mission-driven culture, aligning with his military background.

Transcript:
Josh Gray 0:00
Helping people, at some point, you realize that what you’re doing is changing lives. Now there’s a version of that thought that is pretty cheesy, thought, like it’s silly to think about, but people are making decisions that are going to affect the rest of their lives, and you’re part of that process, so you can lead them the right way. You can lead them down the wrong way they don’t know.

Matthew Allred 0:28
Hello and welcome to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the Allred group. I am your host, Matt Allred in this podcast, we talk to the people whose lives and careers are dedicated to the vertical transportation industry to inform and share lessons learned, building upon the foundation of those who have gone before to inspire the next generation of elevator careers. Today, our guest is Josh gray senior recruiter with the Allred group, a leader in elevator industry recruiting. Josh spent 24 years serving his country in the US Air Force. With 15 of those years working as an Air Force recruiter, although the transition from military to civilian life can be a challenge for many people, Josh has been successful and has many insights to share on that process. Josh is loving his work recruiting elevator professionals, and has found some of the same camaraderie he enjoyed in the military. Josh, welcome to the show.

Josh Gray 1:23
Thank you for having me.

Matthew Allred 1:25
Yeah, no I’m excited. This is it’s gonna be fun. And obviously I want to learn a little bit about your your military career and transition. But you know, obviously you know you’re recruiting career as well. So what was it that that inspired you to get into the military?

Josh Gray 1:47
You know, growing up in the in the time that you and I did, there was a couple movies out there that were really motivating a Top Gun, Full Metal Jacket. I think I just, I saw things in those that you know, kind of fired me up and got me one to serve. And then I actually, actually went to an air show when I was in high school. Had never been to one before my I saw some guys walking around the flight line, Darren camo, but looked really put together, like, I’m out and like, that’s what you see on TV, like what you saw in the movie. I’m looking at them working hard, lot of sweat and and, but they’re smiling, having a good time, high fiving. And I was like, something’s wrong here. There’s no, I mean, jobs are supposed to be horrible, you know, you’re not supposed to have a good time, right? So I just, I just gravitated towards that I had I talked to a recruiter in the past

Matthew Allred 3:00
like so in high school, you’d already talked to somebody

Josh Gray 3:03
yeah. So when you take it’s called the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery test as, yeah, thank you. Yeah. They when you take that, most high schools have it obviously on record, because the branch of service, that’s how they find individuals that may have the aptitude to serve. The recruiters get a hold of that, they’ll reach out to you. I took it. Everybody started calling the Marine Corps, called army, called the Navy, called Air Force, called. I had different conversation,

Matthew Allred 3:39
right? They’re like knocking on your door saying

Josh Gray 3:41
Well, I gotta be straight with you, man, I actually was, you know, we used to have the PA system. Came over the PA and said, anybody that wants to take the ASVAB, all I heard was an opportunity to get out of geometry.

Matthew Allred 3:59
Anybody that wants to get out of geometry, please go take it as a map. Yeah. So

Josh Gray 4:03
I go down to the lunch room. I sit down. I have absolutely no idea. Sky’s in uniform walking around. I didn’t care, you know, and I just, I tried, but it’s not a it wasn’t like I was given my all prepared to take it, took it. Recruiters called, like I said. I turned them all down and ended up going to this air show like I said. I see some things. End up talking with my dad. There’s something not right here. These guys are having a good time and they’re getting paid. Why are they smiling? And we had that conversation that, you know, I guess it was time for me to have as a teenager, which was, you know, there are things you can enjoy doing and get paid, right? Doesn’t have to be miserable. As a matter of fact, I suggest you not do that, because, you know, life would be pretty, pretty rough that way. I called the recruiter back, and he’s. Like, you know, said, Hey, I don’t know if you remember me. He’s like, Yeah, I remember you. And we connected. And things just started, you know, doors just started opening up, and we talked to this day. As a matter of fact, he lives in Vegas, wow. Okay. He works for a company that, if you go to any kind of events, concerts, whatever you see these guys with yellow and black security, sure, so he’s like some type of Vice President in it, you know, it’s, he’s, he’s really done well. But you know, matter of fact, he just talked to me about, you need to become a recruiter. Like, I’m never doing that.

Matthew Allred 5:50
There’s no way, I’m sure. So this is after you joined. So you you end up joining. And he was still involved. Somehow, you were still acquainted. And he was like, Yeah, you need to be on this side of the branch, yeah,

Josh Gray 6:04
yeah. Why not? That’s not gonna happen, right? So, no, yeah. So you know some people you connect with no matter where your career takes you. You know, I I still talk to people today after retirement, I talk to them probably at least anywhere from once a week to once a month. And so anyway, he was, he was kind of a mentor. You know? He was basically everything that I had heard a recruiter was not going to be. He was straight with me. He told me things I didn’t like to hear, but I need to hear. He helped prepare me for boot camp and things like that.

Matthew Allred 6:40
What had you heard about recruiters? Right? What? What

Josh Gray 6:44
you can you can hear about it now, and you can find it online. As a matter of fact, they have, they have. There have been some internet sites that would lead you away from joining the military by telling you every bad thing a recruiter is or will do. And obviously, back then, we didn’t have the internet, but it was, it was very Be careful what they tell you, they’ll be dishonest. This guy was completely straight with me, like everything he said that was going to happen, and how we go is, is how it happened and and frankly, if I’m thinking about it the right way. It probably is why I became a recruiter. It’s because I had a good recruiter. He took care of me.

Matthew Allred 7:28
Tell me a little bit about, I mean, you sound like initially you were like, Heck, no, there’s no way I’m gonna and so for the first several years of your career, you were, you were doing something top secret that you can never reveal, as I understand it, yeah,

Josh Gray 7:42
I did something for about 10 years that that I don’t, I don’t really talk about a whole lot, just because of the the nature of it, and it’s just what it is to do that. And there’s certain careers like that, obviously, that you, you you you acknowledge you did, but you don’t. You don’t really talk a whole lot about I was a little burnt out on that, and the Air Force was going through a time to where they wanted you to branch out and do other things. There are certain career fields, like recruiting, that are considered special duty assignments that you would request to be a part of I chose to do that so I had to go meet with a local recruiter near or where the base I was at, they interviewed me.

Matthew Allred 8:29
How did you get over the initial hump? Because it sounds like you were like, Heck, no, right. What was it that kind of made you rethink that?

Josh Gray 8:39
I called him. I said, hey. Well, I called him to talk about it, not that I was going to do it. I felt like he would be straight with me, which he was. And when I sat down with the flight chief, which is the term for basically on a team, the individual that pushes the recruiters to do their mission, and is the boss. He said, you know, Josh, what questions do you have? I said, I don’t feel comfortable being dishonest. You know, what is your take on that when I say that? And he said, Well, being dishonest in recruiting here and now will get you fired and will ruin your career. It’s like, okay? And he was right. I watched it happen, too. Yeah, yeah. So I applied lengthy application. Had to take a picture of myself, you know, I had to get an official photo of myself in blues, one of the only career fields truly that how you look probably does matter. You’re an ambassador, and what the perception is of the branch of service that you are in. Um. Them, and that would be by the public or by or by fellow service members. So if you’re not going to wear your uniform correctly or whatever, or you have a hard time doing that, you’re not going to be selected in the same cat you know, you’re not in the same category of selection as somebody who’s there’s a, kind of a crude term of poster boy, poster girl for whatever. That’s what that term is like. That’s, I know, I’ve got friends that got slapped on a poster. Was everywhere. We made fun of them. It’s not cool to us. Well, I mean, yeah, it’s not. It’s cool on the outside. Wow. You know, I want to be that guy or her. I want to, I want to get my pick. Nah, you, you get that. That’s somebody’s, everybody’s going to call you and go, must be nice. Yeah. So

Matthew Allred 10:52
What the, what would you, I mean, what would be the, what was the hardest part of, kind of wrapping your head around this, this thing we call recruiting, what was the I’m there’s a lot of uncertainty, right? There’s a lot of, hey, you need to go find, you know, we call it sometimes a purple unicorn, right? That just the, the exact, you know, ideal I have in my mind, and I need to go find that. So I’m just curious what, what was the hardest part of kind of learning? Learning the trade

Josh Gray 11:28
So you go to a school house. So actually, brick and mortar structure, recruiting school. I think I took one written test the whole time I was there, or computer written, actually, with pencils and everything. The rest of it was scenario based. So when I say that, I’m talking about it was like a go, no go, thumbs up, thumbs down. Either you can do it or you can’t, and they put you in uncompromising, uncomfortable situations. Speeches, that was probably the hardest thing, was tapping into that part of me that will flip a switch and have this podcast with you, and then get oh, and then after we’re done, unless it’s work related, I may not speak to anybody but my family the rest of the day. And I think that’s natural for some for me, I don’t. Professionally. I’m one way. Obviously, I’ve been doing a long time, and then I have a different version of my personal life.

Matthew Allred 12:39
So you’re not a social butterfly that just goes out and no, talks to everybody and every about everything, and yet, when you like, you say you hit the switch and it’s like, hey, we have a mission. I need to go find such and such

Josh Gray 12:40
If we were looking for elevator mechanics today, I’ll call anyone. I’ll talk them to death. Yeah, I know that seems kind of crude, but that’s really it, and when I’m done, other than speaking to my family about their day, I may just sit me quiet the rest of the time.

Matthew Allred 13:11
What did you enjoy most about recruiting once you really got into it?

Josh Gray 13:17
Helping people, at some point you realize that what you’re doing is changing lives. Now there’s a version of that thought that is pretty cheesy, thought, like it’s silly to think about, but people are making decisions that are going to affect the rest of their lives, and you’re part of that process. So you can lead them the right way. You can lead them down the wrong way. They don’t know. There are sisters, Mama’s brother’s cousin, who tell them how it was back in 1975 they may think they know a lot. So much has changed since then. So you’re really leading individuals into saying, like, a career path. Do you want to take this career path? Do you qualify for this career path? And how can I help you get started? I absolutely loved learned. I say learned because I didn’t know it, but I actually loved helping people, yeah, feeling like I was a part of their process, because at the end of the day, you know, I had a career. Well, somebody replaced me. That’s kind of one of the things I was mentored up front, is, when it came to my career, no one’s going to take care of you better than you. That doesn’t that’s not a selfish thing, but make sure you’re taking care of yourself and your career. Two is leave it better than the way you found it, and to do that is the training, the mentoring of others. Because one day, and it happened, I leave, I fade away, the people that were in my circle, I was in their circle. Those are the only people I talk to right now. I’m just, I’m not even a memory to most. It’s just that way. But somebody replaced me, right? And that’s how, that’s how a branch of service as an example is over 100 years old.

Matthew Allred 15:16
Sure. Yeah, yeah. So in addition, you’ve I always assumed that that military recruiters only recruited 18 year olds out of high school and had them do push ups or climb the little rock wall or whatever. But you’ve told me, it’s obviously a lot more. It’s doctors, nurses, probably everybody on base. Were you also recruiting other, other recruiters that would come into your program? Or what is it?

Josh Gray 15:44
Yeah, yeah. So just to touch on what you said, yes, your your your baseline start in recruiting, your entry level into recruiting would be high school, individual students that are either getting ready to graduate, or at the summer after graduation, and even beyond, up to a certain age. And then we also would bring in individuals who were called prior service. They had served, they had honorably left, and then they decided to come back. You know, maybe the grass wasn’t greener on the other side, or whatever their plan was, whatever they missed it, they would come back, and you would put them back in under their previous most times under their previous job code to do the same job they were doing before. But as you progress, the longer you stay in recruiting, there’s officer sessions. So certain career fields are really driven by individuals who have a certain type of degree. And then you’ve got health professions. I did. I recruited doctors and dentist nurses who have not only a certain degree, but they have a certain certification or license to do the job. And and then we also had recruiters that if you were on active duty and you were leaving, you had to talk to this recruiter to make sure you didn’t want to continue your service on a part time basis. Okay, okay, so you’ve, let’s say you did a six year enlistment, all of this training that has been put into you. You completed? Are you sure you want to just go to the house and be done? Right? Because we have a certain percentage that comes back to us. Interesting. So if we catch them at the door, we help them transition to a reserve side, wherever they’re going to call home. They go home. And then, in that case, they would participate one weekend in a month, two weeks a year minimum, and they would keep their service active, but just in a part time role

Matthew Allred 17:51
Interesting. So kind of Yeah, kind of recruiting as they’re walking out the door is another part of it, which makes sense, right? You got a huge organization, you got to keep the talent flowing in and make sure it continues to function. And so that’s that’s really your job as a recruiter is just breathing in that life that talent, yeah, to make sure that they can, can fulfill, fulfill the mission. Basically

Josh Gray 18:16
Yes, And you had mentioned about recruiting recruiters, once you got to the level of senior recruiter, or what we call flight chief, which is the same individual that I interviewed with, we have a recruiter for the leadership level that’s called recruit, the recruiter program, oddly enough, And you actually go out on base, find service members that might want to have interest in being recruiters, and you recruit them, you interview them, you put their package together, their picture together, you send it to headquarters. And so even as a even as a boss, I had a certain amount of package submittals that I had to give each year in hopes of getting a, you know, if it was three, to get one of them to actually become a recruiter in our program.

Matthew Allred 19:14
So you only recruit from within the you don’t, you don’t go out on the open market and find a recruiter and say, Hey, you want to join the military.

Josh Gray 19:22
Some of them, as long as they’re as long as they’re serving with us, I say they had been in a different branch of service as a recruiter, we we do consider that as a previous experience. But majority of what I’m talking about are individuals that were just like me. They’re like, I need to change some I had somebody said, I’ve always wanted to be a recruiter. I’m just, I’m just trying to get all the pieces in place to make myself competitive towards being chosen. And then they go to an evaluation course for about a week where they, if anything, try to explain what recruiting is going to be right, but also dissuade you from doing it. Okay, okay, yeah, because it’s, it’s a tough. It’s, a tough. There are no set hours there, there’s time away from family, there’s, I have recruited while on vacation in a port in the Caribbean when I shouldn’t have been, but that’s what I had to do. That was on my anniversary one year it didn’t go over well, yeah, but, but also, what put us in that position to be there is keeping the pipeline moving forward. So it was an issue. I felt the need to take care of it. I took care of it and but that’s a part of understanding that there are jobs where at 435 o’clock you’re done, you go home every day. Recruiting is not that way.

Matthew Allred 20:53
Yeah, that’s fascinating. It’s interesting that too, that you would, I guess, look internally, you know, somebody could be jumping out of a plane one month, and then a few months later, they’re, they’re working as a recruiter. And I guess the just the it’s, you have to be, sounds like you have to be, you got to be a soldier first. I don’t know if that’s the right term, right? You got to be in the military. Firm, yes, yes. And then it’s like, okay, then you can, then you can add this special duty on.

Josh Gray 21:22
Well, this will, you’ll probably agree with this, Matt, how can you sell what you don’t know true? I mean, you’re you. I have no credibility with you of joining the Air Force if I’m not sitting in a, you know, really sitting in a uniform showing that I’ve been here for a number of years, and I can speak, speak about it to a you know, to a certain degree, your your sales opportunity there is not going to be very high. There’s going to be people that join but more often than not, you probably let them astray with something that you didn’t know what you’re talking about. You know, that’s the worst thing you can do. He can go find the information, but don’t give it until you know what it is, because they’re they’re going to latch on to that and go. Sergeant Gray said this, right? So whatever Sergeant gray saying is going to be, to the best of my knowledge, the way it is.

Matthew Allred 22:18
Yeah. Awesome. Awesome. So having, having made the transition from military to civilian life, what are some of the challenges that you you faced?

Josh Gray 22:31
I think you know you for me, I served for 24 years, and I think you the civilian lifestyle and the military lifestyle are different. One’s not better than the other. I don’t think. I just think. I just think it’s different, and the military is made to be different than the civilian lifestyle. That’s why they they do things just the expectation is different and such. When you’ve been doing that for whatever amount of time you’ve been doing yet, and then you transition to the civilian side, professionally, the language is different. As far as you know, you may have a job in the air force that has no brother or sister comparable in the civilian side of the house. So what do you go do? Or how do you take your skill set, put it on paper, get in front of the right person, and then verbalize it to an employer right in front of you that you’re the person they should choose and spend resource and time on to to better their company. So and even you know the assertiveness you know in the military world, assertiveness is required, or you’re not going to make it timeframes. Many of them are. You can’t, you can’t bust a timeframe. You can’t be late. You know, on things, it could cost lives and resources. So sometimes in the civilian world, they don’t function that way. If you miss it, you miss it, you get it. When you get done, it’s hard to transition to that. It’s hard to it’s hard to mesh in sometimes. So I think, I think, I think it’s said to be hard. We talk about it being hard, but a lot of things you might agree, until you do them, you don’t realize really how hard it is for you to transition to doing somethng else.

Matthew Allred 24:49
Well, and especially, like you said, 24 years, right? Really, from from high school on and to to make that shift. I’ve just known some people that, hey, that’s. A tough, maybe tough, to find your place in the world. And yeah, if my job doesn’t translate, how do I then find a find a place, find a new social network. Because everybody I knew is no longer you know in my day to day. So now I gotta find new friends. I gotta find maybe I’m even relocating coming home from different country, and it seems like there’s a lot involved there and programs anyway. Go ahead.

Josh Gray 25:31
Yeah, I didn’t mean to cut you off there. I just what you said is perfect. They veterans also don’t necessarily know what they’re applying for. I mean, they, they don’t, they don’t have if you, if you did 20 years, for example, in your late 30s, early 40s, and you’ve not ever had to answer. I mean, apply to a job, post, write a resume. Would you not agree that most employers are probably going you should already know how to do that for sure, but they never had to. I mean, it’s just something like that. Is just a one example of, you know, stress about, oh, it’s easy. Just find it on the internet and fill it out. Okay, we can do that, but we still don’t know. We’ve not had the, you know, 10 job interviews just to get the 11th one. They’ve not had any and they need a job now. They’re making a transition now under under certain constraints and things like that. So you’re absolutely right. It’s there. There are probably just unthought of struggles, sure, that are taking place every day, with individuals that are leaving a branch of service to go back out into the civilian world.

Matthew Allred 26:43
What are some of the programs available to those who are getting out? And then is that something that you participated in?

Josh Gray 26:51
Yes, one thing they do is called Transition Assistance Program, and that is a that is a government driven program takes individuals that have decided to leave and tries to put them through a course of understanding how to how to write a resume, how to use the acronyms we use, but don’t put them on a resume and, you know, type out, verbalize what you’re trying to say that a civilian employer or human resources would understand things about your insurances being different. You know your medical care when you’re when you’re serving on duty, you don’t pay for medical care now you do and, and, and how does that affect how much, what, what type of chunk is coming out of your check, wherever you’re going to work. How does that work? So they just pretty helpful from that aspect. You can’t cover everything, but it gives you kind of a, kind of a nudge and a head start towards getting out. One program that I utilized. It’s called the skill bridge program. So the it allows you to apply well before basically your last six months of separation or retirement, you apply. You establish yourself with a company that wants to basically sponsor you. They’re going to train you for six months. The last six months you’re there, you continue to get paid by your branch of service. The employer does not have to pay you. So they win in that they get a trainee. They provide resources and training. Get them ready for a position that they would might want them to do for their company. The government continues to pay them at that six month mark, they get someone that was already highly trained, structured, regimented, disciplined, taught them something now they can use them as an employee if both sides agree. What the veteran gets is not such a culture shock or a shock of any type, anda little bit of a slower transition to to the civilian world. An example of that might be for 24 years, the Air Force supplied me, issued me a uniform, boots, what to wear, when to wear it, maybe in that six month time frame, a skill bridge. You can learn that you have a wardrobe or you have to go get one, to go to work every day, and so it’s a lot easier to do that then than to be trying to find a job. You’ve already been separated, you’ve already been retired, or you have retired now you’re trying to find a job. You don’t know what to wear. There’s some stresses in that that maybe you don’t have to go through. And it’s kind of a win, win situation for both parties involved

Matthew Allred 29:52
Yeah, well, especially, yeah, the employer doesn’t have to pay because the military is paying. Then they they really have no. Risk to, to bring on somebody, try them out, you know, maybe, maybe love them, you know, maybe not, but, but they weren’t paying so, so we can bring somebody on, see how it goes, and, like I said, Give somebody a chance to to get to know, you know, this job, this company, this, you know, some of the civilian life. So having having landed in the elevator industry and doing some elevator recruit what? What’s your assessment so far? What are your thoughts?

Josh Gray 30:28
So I love it. I think wise. I find similarities to my military career. So part of my struggle in leaving was I was fine. I was prepared myself as well as I could. I wasn’t fully prepared things happened. I didn’t know about my family, and I were able to overcome those no matter how great or small. Tried a few things out work wise, able to do it, but something was missing the whole time, like there was a piece of me missing. So I think what that was that I have figured out with the elevator industry is that I need to be somewhere where I am serving, and of value, I’m a serving. You know, I still want to change lives. So if I’m going to do it, I want it to be that. You know that we’re recruiting the right people. When I talk to individuals on the phone, even today, you know about the Allred group, I say we’re trying to find elite talent and put them in positions to make the industry better, not just your company, the industry better. The people I’ve come to find out, are super passionate about what they do in this industry. They care that they come across like they care about each other. I’m having some really great conversations that lead me to believe that I’m being allowed into the circle, sure of this industry, but it kind of goes back to, I mean, it’s funny you asked that. It kind of goes back to being a teenager and feeling like you want to be a part of something bigger than you are and complete a mission. And I’m getting to do that again in my elevator industry career, with bringing all this skill set and stuff. So if we look back on what you’re asking the skill bridge and everything that I had accomplished, I’m getting to bring into the elevator industry and make it better. And if I’m making it better, then selfishly, at some point it’s better for me and my family. I mean, we all have to do what our part of this industry to keep it strong and to keep putting food on the table, you know, and or whatever you have going on, and it’s allowed me to do that, and it’s nothing against what I did before, but it just felt like more like a job, sure, and and the military is not punching a clock like I never, ever punched a clock. You usually show up early, early, you stay late if need be, you get the job done, and you have a good time with the best people in the world. And I’m trying to duplicate that in this industry, and I really feel like it’s there, and it’s been that way thus far.

Matthew Allred 33:32
It’s awesome. Yeah, thank you. And I’ve noticed that, you know, since I started working in the the elevator industry, there is a camaraderie. There is a something special, and that’s part of the reason I have these conversations, because I feel myself. I’m like, we need to talk about that. So thank you for bringing it up. Thank you for being here with me today, and I enjoy working with you. So thanks. Thanks again.

Josh Gray 33:58
I’m happy to be here. I appreciate the opportunity too, because there are guys like me out there, just to be honest with you, that the industry may not know how to get to them, but they also don’t know how to get to the industry, you know. And on side note, you know, just the way that you and I, you know, I kind of pulled another ASVAB getting out of geometry. I saw this job post and said, elevators. That’s hilarious. I thought it was funny. I’m gonna apply for that. Matt Allred called and here I am. Yeah, my intent was not to go get this job. It turned out to be the absolute best thing I could have done. And it’s funny, just in life, I think, I think that’s how things happen. It usually happens when you’re not paying attention, or you’re not trying so hard. But, I mean, it’s, it’s kind of like finding that niche, like you said, I have finally found my albeit it took me three years to find

Matthew Allred 34:56
when you talked about, you know, they don’t. Know how to find, find the industry or the industry? No, find, find them. That’s our job, right? Our job is to to make that magic happen, make that connection, and that’s why we’re here. So thank you again. Josh I enjoyed it, and Yeah, appreciate your time. Thank you. Thank you for listening to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the Allred group, a leader in elevator industry recruiting. Please visit our YouTube channel at Elevator Careers, or check us out online at elevatorcareers.net. Please like and subscribe and until next time, stay safe.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai